650B2 valve clearances

Is it common for intake clearances to be tight compared to the exhaust?
I measured the valve clearances this weekend, and was pleased that all the exhaust were in spec, .005" to .007"

I then went to the intakes and could not get a feeler under 3 of them, and the other took a .0015".

I'm wondering if I should be looking at something else.

Kent - I doubt that there should be any correlation between exhaust and intake shims and the clearances. They should all be on the same scale of clearance. One type of valve seat doesn't wear faster than the other. Get a 2.0 shim for use when there is no clearance or put your skinniest shim in and give it a shot measuring. Also make sure you have the cams turned correctly when measuring. There are actually marks on a Z1/KZ900 cam shaft sprocket to line up with the valve cover gasket to help you get the cams in place to make the clearance measurement. Not sure on the 650.

It's debatable the correct way to measure clearances. The manuals say to do it like Wiredgeorge pointed out using the timing marks ect. A factory Kawasaki mechanic told me most engines will be set up too loose using this procedure. Loose doesn't hurt anything though. The way I was taught was to first decide what basic clearance you want in shim size increments, so you can choose .05mm, .10mm or .15mm as your desired clearance. .10mm is a good basic start, so I take a .10mm feeler and try to insert it betweem the cam and the bucket as I slowly turn the engine over with the 17mm socket. If anywhere throughout the entire rotation of the cam the feeler slides in, then you have your clearance, then try your .15mm feeler, if it doesn't insert you are done with that valve and move on. Take your .06, .08, .11mm ect feelers and put them in storage because you never need to use them. Only use feelers in .05mm increments.

wg:wouldnt the exhuast side of valvetrain tend to wear faster ,the valve and seat are constantly being heated,where as the intake atleast has cool air running over it everytime the valve opens?anytime we build one of our boat engines we use the rocker arms and balls from the intake side and run them on the exhuast side and install new ones on the intakeside since the intakes tend to last longer so we can get more use from them :whistle: goodluck,happy wrenching!

I measured the intakes per the manual, at the marks on the cams. And then I tried rotating the engine around and inserting the feelers, no difference.
I'll have to remove the intake cam now, and check the shim sizes... sometime in the next few days.
Thanks guys

UPDATE:

I went to House of Kawasaki in OKC to buy a 2.0mm shim and spoke with a couple guys in the service dept. They went over the whole shimming procedure with me, and offered to trade shims when I brought them in. They said if I could not get my .0015” feeler in there, but the bucket spins, then we would go down 3 sizes on the shim. On the other valve with .002” clearance we would do 2 sizes. They said go get the shims first. Great! Back to the garage I go.

I get to TDC for 1-4, mark the chain and cam sprockets, pulled the intake cam and removed the buckets and shims. The shims were clearly marked with the size. I checked and double-checked the shim chart and the guys at the shop were correct about the sizes. I go back to the shop, they check my shims, swap for the right ones, which are marked, and off I go.

When I get home I get the proper shim in the right valve, put the buckets back on and somehow manage to totally screw up the cam timing. Maybe pulling the cam chain adjuster was not a good idea. :whistle: I eventually had to remove the exhaust cam and start from step one. But after some trials I do get the cam chain tight up in the front, it droops in between the cams, both cam arrows even with the head, with 36 pins between them. The adjuster is back in too, and the caps are snugged to about 7 lbs torque. Everything looks good and I slowly turn the engine over a few times, nothing stops or hangs up, all the marks are still on the money. Great, right?

I check the clearances and the three tight valves are in spec, but the valve that originally had .002” is now too tight to slip the .0015” feeler in!! What went wrong here? The old shim was a 2.45, and I put in a 2.35, I should have plenty of clearance. I am sure the shims went back in to the correct valve. All I can think is that the shim may have moved off the stem and is riding on top of its little pocket instead of in it. Is this possible?

OKC_Kent wrote:

I check the clearances and the three tight valves are in spec, but the valve that originally had .002” is now too tight to slip the .0015” feeler in!! What went wrong here? The old shim was a 2.45, and I put in a 2.35, I should have plenty of clearance. I am sure the shims went back in to the correct valve. All I can think is that the shim may have moved off the stem and is riding on top of its little pocket instead of in it. Is this possible?

It might be a long shot, but have you verified the thickness of the original shim? It may be worn, in which case it's thinner than the marking would indicate...

I didn't measure any of the old shims, the markings were clear on them. The marking are clear on the new (used) ones too. In fact the 2.35 they gave me was in the package, new and marked. But no, I have not measured any of the new ones either.

I don't see how a 2.45 could wear so much that a 2.35 would now be tight. Wouldn't it have to wear down to a 2.25 or so?

I've seen it said enough times in the archives that it's worth measuring them to believe that there might be something to it (depending on mileage, etc.). Micrometers are cheap ($10-$15 on eBay), and it allows you to be sure about what you have and what you're installing.

Although either way you're going to end up pulling that cam back off, either to reseat or to replace that shim.

I've never seen a shim wear. It would be almost impossible to wear down. I've never seen one marked wrong either, but that is always a possibility.

Then ignore me.

I glanced through the archives, and I've seen it suggested that you take a micrometer with you when buying replacement shims. If they're marked, and they're almost never wrong, why take the micrometer?

*confused*

yOUR OK cHET, (caps off):lol:

I've seen the post too about measuring them. I must have screwed up, i'll check it tonight
Thanks