TOPIC:

What about the low stressed componentns like the shift drum and selector forks taken from a 550 and modified if possible.

I've had a 550 and 1100 motor on the bench next to each other, for double the power the size is maybe only 20 percent fatter-a lot of this being the starter gear mounted on the side rather than the primary shaft as on the 550/650/750 variants.

The 550 mills are boringly reliable -described once as 'the toyota corrolla' of bikes. The only issue with the 550 boxes was a later redesign on the circlips preventing selecting two gears together-don't quote me on that but it came to me from the top mechanic at a kawasaki franchise.

I know Lawson had about 150 bhp, so if you are keen enough and your pockets are sufficiently deep it would be good to think 30 years later and another 300cc that might be improved upon.

I'd be interested in what the limiting factors are here, actually how much power would a 550 gear take...maybe this could be tested to destruction in a lab. Even if you had to replace every race, 550 engine internals are two a penny.

Keep it coming Wayne, love it when people take ideas to the limit.

edit: p.s. spoke to my mate who is a metallurgist regarding lab testing the yeild point on the shear stresses on a 550 gear -all he wanted to know was what happens if you pull the flush!

Pete
"give"???? "GIVE" - what is this 'GIVE' business Tonto....??!! I might have a bit of money behind me, but I am hardly going to 'give' away a item that cost me $5000+.
Hey, I am generous to myself with buying the Panigale R for my birthday, but that doesn't make THAT generous to other people!!!! LOL!!!
Yes. When I get everything overseas here and ready to start pulling the 'J' apart, I will be keeping a record of photos and stories - I have a few mates ( including Bob ( Dr Gamma )) on kz1000r forum who have asked me to do the same thing so I will just double up to do both.
Don't expect anything until after June 2015 when I go to UK to get most of the expensive bits though.
Cheers Pete
Wayne

Don't think I want to try an unproven 'theory' on a motor that will probably cost $25K,'tyrell corp'. Being a race bike, I want it to be reliable as my old A4 which did 5 seasons without doing anything but change the oil and filter!!! Remembering that our 'season' in Forgotten Era only amounts to 6 races meetings a year and they are all fairly short races at that. The A4 now is parked because the last time I changed the oil, it has a tooth attached to the magnetic plug and going by the funny way it started and run, I think it is a tooth that the cam chain runs on and its jumped a tooth and changed the timing.
It is a 987 and was always being thrashed unmercifully by my rider so when I decided the 987 needed fretting up, I though I might as well go the whole deal and try and beat the buggars we race against who all use 1000cc plus.
So I don't wanna have to pull the engine apart after every meeting - at the end of the season is close enough - need to to check the titanium conrods for stretch.
Trying to figure a way to peg the crank pins without welding so that taking the rods out doesn't mean chucking the crank because its all welded up.
What gets me is the Panigale R has titanium conrods and no where in the book does it talk of checking them for service life - yet Carillo say you have to keep an eye on them because they have a time-factor service life.
So once a year is enough for me - we are just a small team of 2 not 8 so having a ultra reliable bike that doesn't need checking every 2nd month is what I want..... and NEED!!!
And the other thing is the ratios on the 550 might not bbs what I want. It probably wouldn't suit the characteristics of the motor ( not knowing much about 550 gearboxes and ratios here I will add ).
Answer one thing, mate - your last line "what happens if you pull the flush" - your've lost me there......! Or is that the "toilet joke - important technical consideration"...?

Answer one thing, mate - your last line "what happens if you pull the flush" - your've lost me there......! Or is that the "toilet joke - important technical consideration"...?

Just clowning with you mate, my offbeat humour; starting with an apparently reasoned engineering analysis but ending on the childish lavatory jokes earlier in thread

Could a modern 6 speed transmission or even just the gears from something like a GSXR1000 be made to fit? That sort of money buys a lot of machining. Good luck and keep us posted

Firestorm3 wrote: Pete
"give"???? "GIVE" - what is this 'GIVE' business Tonto....??!! I might have a bit of money behind me, but I am hardly going to 'give' away a item that cost me $5000+.
Hey, I am generous to myself with buying the Panigale R for my birthday, but that doesn't make THAT generous to other people!!!! LOL!!!

I guess a request for adoption is out of the question then?


;

steell wrote:

Firestorm3 wrote: Pete
"give"???? "GIVE" - what is this 'GIVE' business Tonto....??!! I might have a bit of money behind me, but I am hardly going to 'give' away a item that cost me $5000+.
Hey, I am generous to myself with buying the Panigale R for my birthday, but that doesn't make THAT generous to other people!!!! LOL!!!

I guess a request for adoption is out of the question then?

Gee, 'steell', sorry mate, but you might have to wait in line behind my teenage daughter - I am pretty sure she has made a list of things she will do and buy when I 'suddenly and unfortunately' die on my motorbike - caught her looking up the best way to cut brake lines on a motorcycle without getting caught by the cops...... ... LOL!!!

Just hope she does it on the VTR and not the Panigale - the Duke is wayyyy too pretty to crash and burn on....
Wayne

Did the true S1 bikes have 6-speed transmissions? Ed

650ed wrote: Did the true S1 bikes have 6-speed transmissions? Ed

G'day Ed.
No. Just a 5 speed like all of other jap bikes of the era, except it was a CR box unlike any road bike. 6 speeders came in much later, with Kwakasakis it was when they went to the GPZ900r I think.
I am lucky that another forum member Bob ( Dr Gamma ) and I have become mates, Bob used to race a genuine S1 back in the early 80's - kicking himself now that he sold it to a Jap guy and bike resides in Japan. If I need any questions answered, Bob can answer 99% of my questions - the other 1% has slipped out of the grey cells because he is an old c*nt like me!!!!
Aren't you Bob.....???!! LOL!!~!
As I said, I just want to try a 6 speeder just to be different and I because I can - and I don't want to play around with trying this and that to see if it works. Just wanna put it in and forget about it like I did with the old reliable A4.
Bought that NEW, by the way, in December 1975 as a Christmas present to myself...... see, I was STILL generous to myself back then too....!!!!!!!!! LOL!!!!!
Also made good friends with 4 guys on the KZ1000R forum - one guy, Peter from Vienna, has done a magnificent S1 replica, and its going to be hard to beat his attention to detail!!!! (picture included ).





Cheers, Ed
Wayne

opps - picture didn't make it, I think. Try again.....

Couple of questions and sorry to go off topic, no more clowning i promise... but is that bright green the same as the factory z1000r R2 colour? looks a bit brighter to me, I like very much and did mine in a later kawasaki racing green.

Also that swing arm, is that from a zrx , or was the zrx modeled on something before that?

No apology needed mate for going off topic but still talking about Kwakasakis all good!!

Knowing Peter, he would have done it to the exact right colour that the S1 came in - and I think (??) that it is the Kwaka Green that the KLR came in - maybe because the picture was taken in bright sun it looks a bit different.
Compare it with a couple of others and a genuine S1 off Ebay ( for US $107600 ) with zero miles on it ....so that would have to be the right colour, yes? The other bike is a race bike in Germany, also a copy, belonging to Klaus who runs a business making stuff for S1 - those S1 copy brakes are his.

The swingarm - mate, that was a one-off special just for the S1. I have posted pictures of mine - the guy who made it was a true artist, the welds are brilliant. I do a lot of welding myself ( and have 6 welders including a lovely $12K Fronius pulse MIG that makes amateurs look professional!!! ) and I can no longer do welds that nice, especially since my hands aren't that steady and eyes are crap.
The thing, I would think you would agree, is a work of art. Note the cam adjusters for back axle, race stand lugs, built in oil catch can - and it is very very light - a perfect replica of the S1 swingarm - and a price to match!!!!
No, and I won't leave you that in my will either, mate.....!!!
Cheers
Wayne

Firestorm3 wrote: No apology needed mate for going off topic but still talking about Kwakasakis all good!!

Knowing Peter, he would have done it to the exact right colour that the S1 came in - and I think (??) that it is the Kwaka Green that the KLR came in - maybe because the picture was taken in bright sun it looks a bit different.
Compare it with a couple of others and a genuine S1 off Ebay ( for US $107600 ) with zero miles on it ....so that would have to be the right colour, yes? The other bike is a race bike in Germany, also a copy, belonging to Klaus who runs a business making stuff for S1 - those S1 copy brakes are his.

The swingarm - mate, that was a one-off special just for the S1. I have posted pictures of mine - the guy who made it was a true artist, the welds are brilliant. I do a lot of welding myself ( and have 6 welders including a lovely $12K Fronius pulse MIG that makes amateurs look professional!!! ) and I can no longer do welds that nice, especially since my hands aren't that steady and eyes are crap.
The thing, I would think you would agree, is a work of art. Note the cam adjusters for back axle, race stand lugs, built in oil catch can - and it is very very light - a perfect replica of the S1 swingarm - and a price to match!!!!
No, and I won't leave you that in my will either, mate.....!!!
Cheers
Wayne

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Very Nice!

I only read bits and pieces of the posts in this thread... for what you're after in the transmission two thoughts come to mind...

a] you don' need a six speed...but that's my opinion and has nothing to do with satisfying your goal....

b] I would investigate some of the big bore, late model transmissions before laying down a pile of cash for an aftermarket transmission...

Regarding my first comment, If you build the engine properly you'll have so much torque that you can simply use taller final drive sprockets and achieve great results.....