TOPIC:

I am trying to get my 78 KZ650 to start. Major trouble there. I figured I would ensure the timing is good. I am attempting to follow the directions online however I am having a bit of trouble. I get the timing mark to the "f" point for the side I am going to work on. I am using a multimeter as the I cannot get the bike running to use a timing light. I placed a lead on the spring and one to ground and have tried rotating the plate, but no matter how far I rotate, both the individual point plate as well as the backing plate, I cannot get the meter to display an open circuit. It always reads ~5ohms. Any help is appreciated.

Eddie

Per Clymer and FSM, the timing should never have to be adjusted from stock. If u replaced stock electronic ignition like I did, then timing has to be set. Your problem is probably somewhere else.
Even if timing is off, bike will fire up. You just dont want to go driving it on a far advanced or retarded state, as that could damage the engine.
Follow the link in my signature and read the FSM, or google fsm pdf and your bike model. Owning a Clymer is really helpful too, worth $30.
Verify spark and carb function first.
If u make a move on timing, mark where it is now with uber fine point sharpie so u can get it back to that point.
Also search electrical troubleshooting to do ohm meter tests of elec syst.

Per this link, check compression first if not starting...
www.dansmc.com/compression_test.htm

I read your first post. Check for coke in the cylinder before moving on, it might pay for your repairs!-) also check to make sure there is a piston in every cylinder! Heh...

You can borrow a compression tester from the auto store, just put $30 deposit down or buy one for same. Really simple to do and only takes 10 minutes.

KZ650 Factory Service Manual FSM 1981 ?
jarlef.no/Kawasaki/PDF/Z650/Files/KZ650-1981manual.pdf

Save it, and also add it in your signature, along with your year, make, model, location, and mods so people can help u bettr.

His bike is a 78 KZ650 --- the 81 pdf won't do him much good.
The 1980 & earlier models have points ignition.

Welcome to the funhouse.

I have a 79/650 and went through the same exercise getting it started several months ago and this week I'm working on points and timing again.

Check the magic 3:

1. Compression - pull a spark plug, thumb over the hole, does it suck? repeat on all 4
2. Spark - pull a plug, connect it and hold it near the block, does it arc? repeat on all 4
3. Fuel - over a gallon of gas in the tank, petcock to run, (fuel in the fuel filter if it has one?), if the bike has been sitting changes are the carbs are varnish and will have to be removed, taken apart and cleaned/inspected for wear part by part

And the checklist:

• ground
• battery
• kill switch
• ignition switch
• do the lights come on?
• coils
• spark plug wires
• spark plug end caps
• plugs (clean and gap)
• is the engine seized when pushing the kick starter? (if yes stop here)

---

Otherwise check the POINTS, clean and gap - engine should fire up - don't rev it if it does, turn it off
timing should be set to factory spec (pull the plugs and disconnect the coils). Timing is not usually a cause of an engine not running.

Good luck. Get the FSM and read up on everything about your bike. Take it slow and work on 1 thing at a time, trying to get it right. Take notes and pictures. Mark parts and positions (timing). Check the parts manual to figure out what's inside certain components, avoid breaking or losing smaller parts.

These good old bikes are fun to work on and learn about mechanics. Just be safe and realistic that you don't find yourself on the road with mechanical failure. If it's over your head find experienced help.

Here is my post from a few months ago with some good information from other members.

Here's how to get started adjusting the KZ650 points.

The manual has several pages of instructions, pictures, etc. on how to set the timing using the static method plus timing light, plus dwell meter. I can give you a fairly easy way that will get you in a pretty close ballpark without a timing light or dwell meter, but you will need a 0.35 mm feeler gauge and a multi-meter or other device to test continuity. To be very precise, the timing light and dwell meter will be needed.

Before attempting to replace or adjust the points the following is important to understand; timing is comprised of two separate components, and BOTH of these components MUST be set properly if the engine is to run well:

--- The GAP - this is the distance the points spread apart when fully open. The GAP is the element that determines the DWELL. In essence, the DWELL is the number of degrees of points cam rotation that the points are closed and this controls the amount of time the coils receive a charge before firing the spark plugs.

--- The TIMING of the initial opening of the points (the point at which the continuity across the points breaks). This controls the precise instant that the coils receive the signal to fire the spark plugs.

Remove the points cover on the right side of engine. Under it you will see 2 sets of points. The set on the left fires cylinders 1 & 4; the set on the right fires 2 & 3. When replacing points observe carefully how the little bits and pieces are arranged where the wires attach. Some of those pieces are actually insulators and if you leave any of them out or put them back in the wrong place the points will be grounded and won't work. Take a very close look at the contact surfaces of the points. If they are pitted you really should replace them. You can sand down pitted points, but they will quickly pit again. Replace one set of points at a time so you can look at the other set in case you get the little bits confused.

Use a 17 mm wrench to turn the nut NEAR the end of the crankshaft clockwise while looking in the hole above that nut. (Do NOT use a wrench on the smaller bolt on the very end of the crankshaft to turn the engine.) Inside that hole you will see a vertical pointer cast into the casing. As you turn the 17 mm nut you will see a 1 & 4 and F and T roll by and then you'll see a 2 & 3 and F and T roll by. Each F and T has a line next to it.

Here's the method I use for static timing. I turn OFF the ignition. I disconnect the green wire near one coil and the black wire near the other coil. (This is not in the book, but it makes checking continuity much easier for me.) After installing the new points or cleaning up the old ones, turn the 17 mm nut while watching the points. When points set 1&4 are at their widest gap adjust them (by loosening the 2 screws that hold the points to the backplate) so the gap equals 0.35 mm. Turn the 17 mm nut clockwise through a full revolution again and double check this gap. Then repeat this for points set 3&4. Now set your meter to test continuity and clip one wire to the leaf spring on points set 1&4 and clip the other wire to ground. Turn the 17 mm nut clockwise until the 1&4 "F" mark aligns with the pointer mentioned above. You want the continuity across point set 1&4 to just break when the F mark aligns with the pointer. The idea is that when the continuity just fails is when the points will fire their respective coil and cylinders. In order to adjust the point at which continuity fails you loosen the 3 screws that hold the backplate to the engine and slightly turn the backplate until the meter shows a break in continuity. Once you have the 1&4 set timed properly you can check the 2&3 set to make sure they break when the 2&3 F mark aligns with the pointer (they should or something is not right). Don't forget to plug in the green and black coil wires when you are done, and put a little grease on the rubbing block felt. Assuming you are using new points of the correct type this should enable you to get the timing very close. Trying this with old points may give poor results, especially if the points are pitted and/or the rubbing blocks are worn.

After you have set the gap (which in effect sets the dwell) and the timing using the method above you can use a dwell meter and timing light to fine tune dwell and timing. If you have followed the above procedure carefully, very little if any fine tuning will be needed.
Sorry this is so long. It's not as difficult as it sounds. Ed

I've worked on many bikes that have had the timing so screwed up they wouldn't start Of course they had points not electronic ignition..
Ed's post is a fine starting point for setting the timing to start the bike, if it doesn't start after following his procedure you have other problems

Ed, your write up is awesome. I tried this with used points which seem to be a little worn. I am going to order some new ones. That said, I am still not even getting an occasional firing, even with starting fluid. This is baffeling. If I had hair long enough to pull out, I would have done so.

It's a parallel circuit.
If you want to use an ohm meter, instead of using voltage, you have to put a piece of paper in the other set of points so they are open all the time.

Disconnecting the green and black wires, as Ed said, will accomplish the same thing.

650ed wrote: I disconnect the green wire near one coil and the black wire near the other coil. (This is not in the book, but it makes checking continuity much easier for me.) Ed

I just had the same issue after installing a new set of points and asked Ed why removing the coil connection to the points makes a difference. Well, I believe since the coils are connected to ground it makes for a continuous loop, in the reverse direction. Disconnecting the 2 wires will solve that issue.

Now, with old points it is super important to make sure they are clean with the correct gap. There is a .35 feeler gauge included with the factory tool set under the seat, it's on the outside of the pouch. This alone was enough indication from Kawasaki that I would be spending serious time with points. Before and after setting the gap make sure they are clean. If you use sandpaper (avoid) there will be fine pieces of metal on the surfaces that will interfere with a true .35 gap. I suggest using something like Deoxit spray with a business card to make sure nothing is left on the point surfaces. Make sure they are dry before starting the engine.

Old points are a pain and should be replaced, so I'm glad to hear you ordered the set. Condensers seem to outlast points but since you are replacing I suggest going with points and condensers.

Replacing points doesn't always mean you need to adjust timing. The points rock on a pivot point that seats in the mounting bracket, so they maintain position. And as you may already know the points gap and the F marks are in sync but not by position (unlike setting the timing).

• Have you tested your coils and wires?
- sometimes the wire and plug covers lose connectivity with neglect

• Are the spark plugs good and gaped?
- check for color, all black is fouled and will not spark

• Is the ignition and kill switch working?
- if either are bad the starter will not spin

• Are you using the kick starter to bypass the clutch start switch (or whatever that is called)?
• Can you open and close the throttle all the way?
- carbs might be locked up if not

• Does the choke open and close all the way?
- carbs might be locked up if not

• How long has the bike been sitting without running?

650ed wrote: ...When replacing points observe carefully how the little bits and pieces are arranged where the wires attach. Some of those pieces are actually insulators and if you leave any of them out or put them back in the wrong place the points will be grounded and won't work....

This is crucial and very easily checked with your meter. Stick a piece of paper in each set of points to keep them open and check for continuity (ohm setting or beep if your meter has that) between the spring and the backing plate - there should be none, if you see continuity something is installed incorrectly.

The insulating spacers, coil wire, condenser wire and spring should be installed like in the pic below (especially note the position of the insulating spacers) - the coil wire, the condenser wire and the spring side of the points should all have direct contact with each other and none of them should have any contact with the backing plate/ground when the points are open or you will have no spark or a weak spark.

If the coil wire isn't in contact with the spring the primary circuit is constantly interrupted = no spark.

If the coil wire is in contact with the spring and both are in contact with the backing plate or if just the coil wire is in contact with the the backing plate the primary circuit is constantly grounded = no spark.

If the coil wire is in contact with the spring and both are insulated from the backing plate but not in contact with the condenser (or the condenser is defective) the condenser will not do it's job when the points start to open = weak spark.